ACES OCIO configs, testing and feedback


Andy Jones <andy....@...>
 

+1 for the common still camera gamuts.  Prophoto, Adobe Wide Gamut, and Adobe RGB.  There's a smattering of different whitepoints and gammas with those, which can be annoying to deal with.

On Wed, Dec 3, 2014 at 12:22 PM, Matt Plec <mp...@...> wrote:
I'm a bit late to the party, but for what it's worth, Red log (with their various red color primaries I assume?), Canon log, and GoPro "protune" were popular requests for inclusion in the default Nuke set, so I expect people will also want to convert between those and ACES.

Two others worthy of consideration are ProPhoto and Adobe RGB. May sound crazy but hear me out.... Having them available makes it possible to produce stills out of vfx tools in a form print/marketing can work with directly and also to bring in stills from print/photography workflows directly to an ACES reference space comp/render.

Cheers,
Matt


On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 7:02 PM, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:
On the IDT side, the current Academy repo includes IDTs for the following cameras / configurations
  • Arri Alexa with the following exposure indices: EI800, EI640, EI500, EI400, EI3200, EI320, EI2560, EI250, EI2000, EI200, EI1600, EI160, EI1280, EI1000
  • Sony F65 Tungsten and Daylight
  • Sony F35
Are those very specific IDTs what you're looking for? What other camera / IDT color spaces would be helpful? Red? Canon? GoPro?

On the point about including conversion between different primaries, what primaries sets would be useful? Rec2020? Rec709? P3? Arri wide gamut?

We're also looking into the legal vs. full range options for spaces like ACESproxy.

Thanks for the suggestions so far,
HP




 



On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 7:50 AM, Francois Lord <franco...@...> wrote:
Yes, and I suspect we will continue to receive camera native material for a while. VFX houses will adopt ACES more quickly than production houses.

Would it be a good idea to include profiles for Rec.2020 so that we can easily convert CG renderings to and from ACES when working with the ocio config?


On Wed Nov 05 2014 at 4:53:54 PM Steve Agland <sag...@...> wrote:
On 6 November 2014 06:56, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:

Could you provide some example of when and how you would use the IDTs with OCIO? From a number of other sources, we're hearing that most IDTs will be applied by the Camera SDKs / toolsets so most OCIO-supporting applications will interact with ACES, ACESproxy or ACESlog images rather than images in the camera raw color spaces.

It's not uncommon to receive external material in camera color spaces and to want to ingest them using the same OCIO-supporting tools that are used for color management internally. That could be scripts, command-line utilities or apps like Nuke. Having the IDTs in OCIO just makes that easier, even though the rest of the pipeline won't necessarily use those transforms.

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Matt Plec <mp...@...>
 

I'm a bit late to the party, but for what it's worth, Red log (with their various red color primaries I assume?), Canon log, and GoPro "protune" were popular requests for inclusion in the default Nuke set, so I expect people will also want to convert between those and ACES.

Two others worthy of consideration are ProPhoto and Adobe RGB. May sound crazy but hear me out.... Having them available makes it possible to produce stills out of vfx tools in a form print/marketing can work with directly and also to bring in stills from print/photography workflows directly to an ACES reference space comp/render.

Cheers,
Matt


On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 7:02 PM, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:
On the IDT side, the current Academy repo includes IDTs for the following cameras / configurations
  • Arri Alexa with the following exposure indices: EI800, EI640, EI500, EI400, EI3200, EI320, EI2560, EI250, EI2000, EI200, EI1600, EI160, EI1280, EI1000
  • Sony F65 Tungsten and Daylight
  • Sony F35
Are those very specific IDTs what you're looking for? What other camera / IDT color spaces would be helpful? Red? Canon? GoPro?

On the point about including conversion between different primaries, what primaries sets would be useful? Rec2020? Rec709? P3? Arri wide gamut?

We're also looking into the legal vs. full range options for spaces like ACESproxy.

Thanks for the suggestions so far,
HP




 



On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 7:50 AM, Francois Lord <franco...@...> wrote:
Yes, and I suspect we will continue to receive camera native material for a while. VFX houses will adopt ACES more quickly than production houses.

Would it be a good idea to include profiles for Rec.2020 so that we can easily convert CG renderings to and from ACES when working with the ocio config?


On Wed Nov 05 2014 at 4:53:54 PM Steve Agland <sag...@...> wrote:
On 6 November 2014 06:56, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:

Could you provide some example of when and how you would use the IDTs with OCIO? From a number of other sources, we're hearing that most IDTs will be applied by the Camera SDKs / toolsets so most OCIO-supporting applications will interact with ACES, ACESproxy or ACESlog images rather than images in the camera raw color spaces.

It's not uncommon to receive external material in camera color spaces and to want to ingest them using the same OCIO-supporting tools that are used for color management internally. That could be scripts, command-line utilities or apps like Nuke. Having the IDTs in OCIO just makes that easier, even though the rest of the pipeline won't necessarily use those transforms.

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Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...>
 

On the IDT side, the current Academy repo includes IDTs for the following cameras / configurations
  • Arri Alexa with the following exposure indices: EI800, EI640, EI500, EI400, EI3200, EI320, EI2560, EI250, EI2000, EI200, EI1600, EI160, EI1280, EI1000
  • Sony F65 Tungsten and Daylight
  • Sony F35
Are those very specific IDTs what you're looking for? What other camera / IDT color spaces would be helpful? Red? Canon? GoPro?

On the point about including conversion between different primaries, what primaries sets would be useful? Rec2020? Rec709? P3? Arri wide gamut?

We're also looking into the legal vs. full range options for spaces like ACESproxy.

Thanks for the suggestions so far,
HP




 



On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 7:50 AM, Francois Lord <franco...@...> wrote:
Yes, and I suspect we will continue to receive camera native material for a while. VFX houses will adopt ACES more quickly than production houses.

Would it be a good idea to include profiles for Rec.2020 so that we can easily convert CG renderings to and from ACES when working with the ocio config?


On Wed Nov 05 2014 at 4:53:54 PM Steve Agland <sag...@...> wrote:
On 6 November 2014 06:56, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:

Could you provide some example of when and how you would use the IDTs with OCIO? From a number of other sources, we're hearing that most IDTs will be applied by the Camera SDKs / toolsets so most OCIO-supporting applications will interact with ACES, ACESproxy or ACESlog images rather than images in the camera raw color spaces.

It's not uncommon to receive external material in camera color spaces and to want to ingest them using the same OCIO-supporting tools that are used for color management internally. That could be scripts, command-line utilities or apps like Nuke. Having the IDTs in OCIO just makes that easier, even though the rest of the pipeline won't necessarily use those transforms.

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Francois Lord <franco...@...>
 

Yes, and I suspect we will continue to receive camera native material for a while. VFX houses will adopt ACES more quickly than production houses.

Would it be a good idea to include profiles for Rec.2020 so that we can easily convert CG renderings to and from ACES when working with the ocio config?


On Wed Nov 05 2014 at 4:53:54 PM Steve Agland <sag...@...> wrote:
On 6 November 2014 06:56, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:

Could you provide some example of when and how you would use the IDTs with OCIO? From a number of other sources, we're hearing that most IDTs will be applied by the Camera SDKs / toolsets so most OCIO-supporting applications will interact with ACES, ACESproxy or ACESlog images rather than images in the camera raw color spaces.

It's not uncommon to receive external material in camera color spaces and to want to ingest them using the same OCIO-supporting tools that are used for color management internally. That could be scripts, command-line utilities or apps like Nuke. Having the IDTs in OCIO just makes that easier, even though the rest of the pipeline won't necessarily use those transforms.

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Steve Agland <sag...@...>
 

On 6 November 2014 06:56, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:

Could you provide some example of when and how you would use the IDTs with OCIO? From a number of other sources, we're hearing that most IDTs will be applied by the Camera SDKs / toolsets so most OCIO-supporting applications will interact with ACES, ACESproxy or ACESlog images rather than images in the camera raw color spaces.

It's not uncommon to receive external material in camera color spaces and to want to ingest them using the same OCIO-supporting tools that are used for color management internally. That could be scripts, command-line utilities or apps like Nuke. Having the IDTs in OCIO just makes that easier, even though the rest of the pipeline won't necessarily use those transforms.


Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...>
 

Good suggestion. We'll have to override some of the currently automatically generated transforms.

Could you provide some example of when and how you would use the IDTs with OCIO? From a number of other sources, we're hearing that most IDTs will be applied by the Camera SDKs / toolsets so most OCIO-supporting applications will interact with ACES, ACESproxy or ACESlog images rather than images in the camera raw color spaces.

Having proper support for IDTs would also be greatly aided by support for dynamic inclusion of color spaces and transforms, but that's a different issue.

HP




On Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 10:24 AM, Dithermaster <dither...@...> wrote:
I'm looking forward to updates to this config, especially when it includes the existing IDTs.

Once comment so far: You don't need a LUT to convert between ACES and ACESproxy; OpenColorIO can do it more accurately (and likely faster) using an AllocationTransform:

        - !<AllocationTransform> {allocation: lg2, vars: [-9.72, 7.8], direction: inverse} # ACESproxy Annex C to ACES

        - !<AllocationTransform> {allocation: lg2, vars: [-9.72, 7.8]} # ACES to ACESproxy Annex C


On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 4:19 PM, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:
Hello OCIO developers and users,

The Academy is moving towards an official 1.0 release of ACES this fall. As part of that development effort, we are looking at the best way to support ACES through OCIO. Building on Alex Fry's earlier work, we have automated the generation of OCIO configs based on the transforms defined in CTL for a given release. Links to the configs representing the latest working group release follow this message.

We are hoping to get your feedback on the following items
  • The new ACES configs
    • What features should we include?
    • What's missing? (IDTs right now, for instance)
  • ACES overall
    • What's blocking adoption as we move towards 1.0
If you are interested in the scripts that were used to generate these configs, let me know and those can be made available.

Thanks in advance for your help,
HP Duiker
Consultant for the Academy on ACES
Duiker Research




Example configs for the latest working group release, WGR8, are available for private evaluation here:

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Kevin Wheatley <kevin.j....@...>
 

you might want to account for different scalings of the log spaces
(full range vs SMPTE levels), although the most useful form for OCIO
is obviously the one in which CDL values apply directly.

Kevin


Dithermaster <dither...@...>
 

I'm looking forward to updates to this config, especially when it includes the existing IDTs.

Once comment so far: You don't need a LUT to convert between ACES and ACESproxy; OpenColorIO can do it more accurately (and likely faster) using an AllocationTransform:

        - !<AllocationTransform> {allocation: lg2, vars: [-9.72, 7.8], direction: inverse} # ACESproxy Annex C to ACES

        - !<AllocationTransform> {allocation: lg2, vars: [-9.72, 7.8]} # ACES to ACESproxy Annex C


On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 4:19 PM, Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...> wrote:
Hello OCIO developers and users,

The Academy is moving towards an official 1.0 release of ACES this fall. As part of that development effort, we are looking at the best way to support ACES through OCIO. Building on Alex Fry's earlier work, we have automated the generation of OCIO configs based on the transforms defined in CTL for a given release. Links to the configs representing the latest working group release follow this message.

We are hoping to get your feedback on the following items
  • The new ACES configs
    • What features should we include?
    • What's missing? (IDTs right now, for instance)
  • ACES overall
    • What's blocking adoption as we move towards 1.0
If you are interested in the scripts that were used to generate these configs, let me know and those can be made available.

Thanks in advance for your help,
HP Duiker
Consultant for the Academy on ACES
Duiker Research




Example configs for the latest working group release, WGR8, are available for private evaluation here:

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Haarm-Pieter Duiker <li...@...>
 

Hello OCIO developers and users,

The Academy is moving towards an official 1.0 release of ACES this fall. As part of that development effort, we are looking at the best way to support ACES through OCIO. Building on Alex Fry's earlier work, we have automated the generation of OCIO configs based on the transforms defined in CTL for a given release. Links to the configs representing the latest working group release follow this message.

We are hoping to get your feedback on the following items
  • The new ACES configs
    • What features should we include?
    • What's missing? (IDTs right now, for instance)
  • ACES overall
    • What's blocking adoption as we move towards 1.0
If you are interested in the scripts that were used to generate these configs, let me know and those can be made available.

Thanks in advance for your help,
HP Duiker
Consultant for the Academy on ACES
Duiker Research




Example configs for the latest working group release, WGR8, are available for private evaluation here: